For the Love of Science + Medicine

[dinoiii]

Oftentimes, I am accused of thinking about the two aforementioned topics maybe too much, but both truly are enjoyable and allow me to employ not only knowledge learned into a true life scenario but incorporate ideas from both of my favorite hobbies.

I am offering in this post an opportunity for you guys to see why I love it so much and see how our shared hobby of bodybuilding and supplementation meets the clinical setting.

Last Friday, I was posed with a colleague who was taking a methylated compound. The trick was he needed his Hepatitis B series 6-month booster and was concerned that potentially elevated LFTs would be a problem with entrance of this recombinant vaccination into his body and the immune response that would follow. I dealt with it accordingly.

So, if it were you guys who were in my position, what advice would you have given my friend with the liver working overtime? I will let you guys tear away at response for a few days before I tell you what I did. I think this is good topic for discussion. Let me hear those armchair scientists/doctors make decisions affecting this guys potential well-being.

[max von]

well Dinoiii i for one would not have an answer for that but then again i am not in the field that you are in and that is something that you would have been taught by your schooling. I on the other hand went to school for a different topic and that is why it is valuable to have people on here that come from different background. I will not sit here and armchair you recommendation cause that is not my specialty

max von

[wedgylx]

Since I'm not very schooled in liver activity, if it were me I'd probably go right to PCT before I got my booster.

[italionstallionl]

i would have to say that he should finish his ph cycle, add in some type of liver product to his pct then get his hepititis shot. just tell him not to step on any rusty nails (that is where you can get hepititis b from right? :? )

[dinoiii]

i would have to say that he should finish his ph cycle, add in some type of liver product to his pct then get his hepititis shot. just tell him not to step on any rusty nails (that is where you can get hepititis b from right? :? )


Hep B is contracted via bood-borne transmission (ie.- needles, etc...) theoretically, there is probably a possibility of transmission if someone with Hep B stepped on the nail first. I think you are thinking of Tetanus though - the organism being clostridium tetani.

[dinoiii]

Good answers thus far though, but say he was in dire need of the shot b/c of a recent contact and could not afford delay.

[italionstallionl]

i definitely was thinking of tetanus

hmmm, that changes everything. ummm i would tell him to get the shot, stay on the ph's and suck it up. whats the worst that could happen? you dont really need a liver anyways



seriously, now i dont know, beyond my realm of knowledge

[max von]

i would tell him to get the shot and try to keep monitoring his liver for any damage. I must admitt i kinda tried to cheat on this by asking the dr on webmd but did not get a response maybe you stumped them too. I like this tho dinoiii making me work at this one

max von

[italionstallionl]

hey dinoiii, has it been long enough? im interested in the answer you gave him

[max von]

yea dinoiii whats the answer

max von

[italionstallionl]

did we all forget about this?

i want to know

[max von]

i guess so what happen to the science answere dinoiii we need the answer

max von

[dinoiii]

Ok - sorry I have not seen this post in a while.


Recap: Colleague was on M1T/MOHN stack. Suffered a needle stick injury in the hospital from Hep B patient and was still not given his 6-month booster (although it was time for the shot - roughly 6-mos time had passed and he was planning on having the booster done in a week).

Initial Workup: included immediate lab work to verify LFTs and creatine kinase. We had results in < 2hrs. showing elevations in AST (significant) and CK (significant). Elevations in ALT was not significant, but had risen and GGT was essentially nil which is actually more likely elevated in alcohol patients.

Interpretation: AST + CK significant elevations potentially due to methylated compounds, but his pre-cycle labs which were done indicated that these enzymes were more chronically elevated (the rationale for which has yet TBD). ALT slightly risen due to potential viral scenario (but really this would be rare to get an elevated reading this quick if that were the case). GGT absent essentially ruled out alcohol abuse.

Plan: Glutathione IV infusion. Concurrent introduction of recombinant vaccination (which is more likely to undergo post-translational modification so antibodies to HBV core and surface antigens would need to be monitored).

Today: LFTs still significantly elevated. I have a feeling it has nothing to do with the methylated compounds. + HBVAbs which implies immunity to virus is likely successful - no antigens (surface, core, e) were present. Will monitor at 1 month.

[max von]

Dinoiii
so what is the bottom line did you give the guy the booster shot or did you hold off. sorry but im just looking for the simple answer kinda like the question was would we give the shot or not

thanks

dino max von

[dinoiii]

re-read the "plan" section above max.


Yes after he was given a glutathione infusion, the vaccine was given concurrently.

[max von]

Dinoiii

okay got it thanks

max von

[wedgylx]

Alas, it has been answered