getting rid of fat not beef

[Stacked]

Question, and i know this has been mentioned in the past- the steps to start losing those couple of unwanted lbs that snuck in there would be, in order: increase intensity of lifting, cut down calories, and then introduce cardio. Would anyone disagree with this? As in would introducing cardio first and keeping caloric intake the same be better for sparing muscle mass? Or will decreasing calories while holding or increasing the intensity of lifting be enough to lose bf only?
Also, when i was doing cardio regularly i ran for an hour with weights in hand, is 30 min but more often/or with more weights better? I mean i know your body doesnt touch stored fat for quite a while unless you were to run in the am on an empty stomach, on the other hand Im not sure whether hour long runs are advised for bodybuilding, sure they help endurance but thats not my main goal now.

[MUbodbuilder]

as a rule for dieting stay away from cardio. if you have to do cardio it means you let yourself go too far in body fat. (most instances) diet is the best way to work off those few pounds. and even if cardio is a choice you take...running is the worst. its far too intense for bodybuilding. stick with early morning walks. but again, if diet is in order it should take care of it self

[Stacked]

too intense in what sense? dont you have to elevate your heartbeat to a certain level to see results with cardio? (vs walking). I understand triathlon/marathon runners will likely lose muscle mass due to the grueling hours+energy required has to come from somewhere but would 30 min jogs be bad, i mean i could drop the weights i used altogether, but it feels great to do a bunch of laps around the lake when temps get warmer, gets you energized for the whole day, just a bitch on the joints. I never believed in biking/walking because my heartrate wasnt going anywhere. I do see a couple of big guys that arent fat at all doing laps in my park, although they disappear after 30 min or so...
Im not saying replace a good diet with cardio just add some once or twice a week and whats the best type/duration/intensity that can be done outside to keep from losing lean mass. With the walks I assume on a completely empty stomach from the night before otherwise the intensity would be too low to be effective right?

[Tick]

too intense in what sense? dont you have to elevate your heartbeat to a certain level to see results with cardio? (vs walking). I understand triathlon/marathon runners will likely lose muscle mass due to the grueling hours+energy required has to come from somewhere but would 30 min jogs be bad, i mean i could drop the weights i used altogether, but it feels great to do a bunch of laps around the lake when temps get warmer, gets you energized for the whole day, just a bitch on the joints. I never believed in biking/walking because my heartrate wasnt going anywhere. I do see a couple of big guys that arent fat at all doing laps in my park, although they disappear after 30 min or so...
Im not saying replace a good diet with cardio just add some once or twice a week and whats the best type/duration/intensity that can be done outside to keep from losing lean mass. With the walks I assume on a completely empty stomach from the night before otherwise the intensity would be too low to be effective right?
But what is the most important muscle of them all ? You have to put sometime into thee most important muscle. You will gain more by cardio then (no cardio and lifting). Controlled breathing when lifting. You won't loss to much by just giving a little time to heart.

[K-Man]

i just walk on a tredmill for 30 min a day at 4 mph with 5% incline and i sweat like crazy from that

[Stacked]

well significant incline on a treadmill id assume is just as much of a workout as a 30 min jog on flat terrain, actually the latter is a lot easier for me, thats why i dont get why running is considered too intense, K-man I take it you watch your heartrate when doing that + have a target zone?

[DriverDan]

Forget all the broisms you've posted, very little of it is true. Remember the one key thing: calories in - calories out = calories lost or gained. Of course that's simplified but it's the basic equation to remember when trying to lose fat. Forget about recomp, just remember that.

[bmoremade26]

i run everyday and it doesnt burn my muscle away at all ..i run for heart health and to be overall good condition... but diet is first as far as burning fat , calories in and calories out is what its going to boil down too... jay cutler /victor martinez and other big pros didnt get down to 2 to 4 percent bodyfat without cardio...

[Stacked]

Thanks, so a little cardio cant hurt to speed up the process...I guess I should have made something clearer- I want to continue gaining lean mass without phs for the time being and at the same time lose the fat, not just turn 100% to cutting and forget about getting bigger, thats why i didnt get the cut calories idea (im always at low fat, low carb, high protein unless im on cycle), cant grow with a deficit in cals right...

[hardcorefitness]

you have to remember that cardio just increases your calorie defecit... it doesn't just target fat

[Stacked]

good point, i just cant do the 5 or 6 healthy meals a day thing and rely on diet alone, when im out of the house 8am-10pm most days i just grab what i can to eat and try to watch my fat and carb intake. but i definitely learned a lot from this thread so thanks to all :D. im gonna try lowering my cals and get some extra carbs in pre-workout to keep my intensity up

[suicide king]

well for what it's worth i read somewhere a good cardio is to run like 20 or 30 seconds and walk for the other 30 seconds for about 15 minutes, enough to get a good burn and not to intense

[MUbodbuilder]

it seems my point was mis-read. then you went on to anwer your own questions. iv only competed 5 times so what do i know...im not a pro.

everyone is diff in how their body burns cals. im just saying for the avrg. BB running for 30min like you stated is far to intense. if your body fat is as low as you say (ex. <9) than NO CARDIO AT ALL is needed to get into contest shape in 15 weeks or so. IMO if you have to run to lose weight...then your diet is either wack or you started at too high a BF and need to give your self longer to diet.

HIIT, as just mentioned above, is an option that many BB find usefull but not to intense. its usually only performed 1-2 times a week tho at most and cut out weeks before the show.

again my opinion stands that no cardio-low intensity cardio is the way to go. i think you will find that muscle/strength is easer to hold through dieting when walking(say 4mph 5%in. for 30min) as to ( 30min run at 7-8mph)

[Disturbed_1]

i run everyday and it doesnt burn my muscle away at all ..i run for heart health and to be overall good condition... but diet is first as far as burning fat , calories in and calories out is what its going to boil down too... jay cutler /victor martinez and other big pros didnt get down to 2 to 4 percent bodyfat without cardio...

I've seen several guys in the military maintain their muscle mass while having to run.I think it really just depends on the individual.Try dieting without cardio and see how it works for you.If you still have too much bodyfat then start doing some form of cardio.

[Stacked]

it seems my point was mis-read. then you went on to anwer your own questions. iv only competed 5 times so what do i know...im not a pro.

everyone is diff in how their body burns cals. im just saying for the avrg. BB running for 30min like you stated is far to intense. if your body fat is as low as you say (ex. <9) than NO CARDIO AT ALL is needed to get into contest shape in 15 weeks or so. IMO if you have to run to lose weight...then your diet is either wack or you started at too high a BF and need to give your self longer to diet.

HIIT, as just mentioned above, is an option that many BB find usefull but not to intense. its usually only performed 1-2 times a week tho at most and cut out weeks before the show.

again my opinion stands that no cardio-low intensity cardio is the way to go. i think you will find that muscle/strength is easer to hold through dieting when walking(say 4mph 5%in. for 30min) as to ( 30min run at 7-8mph)

im lost, who's BF is <9?? i dont ever recall mentioning my bf being anywhere near 9. but i think i get what youre saying now, that if someone had a very low bf cardio would be too intense in the sense that it would have not much to burn other than muscle especially if you did it on an empty stomach, but if your bf is nice and low you dont need cardio to lose fat, thats obvious. so i guess thats the misunderstanding, youre in contest shape, many people on here like me are nowhere close were still trying to bulk for a couple more cycles but in the interim it would be nice to burn off the extra unwelcome weight that was added for one reason or another. as for type of cardio i was under the impression before i found these bb boards like most people that you need to hit target heartrates in your cardio and stay in them, so the whole idea of low intensity cardio being effective is new to me (i quit biking thinking it wasnt an effective form), so as you can see i got a lot to learn but hopefully im getting there :)

[DriverDan]

good point, i just cant do the 5 or 6 healthy meals a day thing and rely on diet alone, when im out of the house 8am-10pm most days i just grab what i can to eat and try to watch my fat and carb intake. but i definitely learned a lot from this thread so thanks to all :D. im gonna try lowering my cals and get some extra carbs in pre-workout to keep my intensity up
That's not an excuse. There are plenty of foods that are easy to prep and take with you.

[MUbodbuilder]

i took it as when you said you were fairly low you would be close to the 10% range or lower. thats why i stated it as an example. but your right, if your at a higher bf than that cardio may be needed. but yes lower intensity cardio is still effective. you dont have to reach any certain goal of heart rate to burn cals. again its like hardcorefitnes said. cals-expenditures determines the factor of what you have to work towards with cardio and diet.

if i were you id aim for 1-2lbs of weight lose a week. running shouldnt be needed for that. for you id suggest the best choice is HIIT. its very intense but such a short session that it only taps into the fat/glycogen stores instead of muscle like extended periods of running can do. do a search on it

[Stacked]

my bad, im at 15% and trying to get a lot bigger before i attempt to get to those bf levels :D, i was just saying i want to lose like 2% or so for now. ill take all the suggestions into account, sounds good
thanks

[DriverDan]

15% to 13% is nothing, you can do that in 2-3 weeks without much effort.

[Terror_Hawk]

I do that stairmaster for 20-30 mins, i love it so much more then any kind of running/jogging.

[Stacked]

just wondering about the cardio in the am on an empty stomach thing, whether its a 30 min jog or HIIT or elliptical etc, for it to only tap into fat/glycogen stores instead of muscle is that more due to the cardio activity being short or it depends more on when you ate last? i mean if you go to bed starving for whatever reason and wake up 10 hours later and do some HIIT for 30 min what are you tapping into?

[hardcorefitness]

just wondering about the cardio in the am on an empty stomach thing, whether its a 30 min jog or HIIT or elliptical etc, for it to only tap into fat/glycogen stores instead of muscle is that more due to the cardio activity being short or it depends more on when you ate last? i mean if you go to bed starving for whatever reason and wake up 10 hours later and do some HIIT for 30 min what are you tapping into?
When doing morning cardio on an empty stomach it is supposed to tap into fat stores because your body's glycogen levels are depleatd from a 8-10 hour fast.

[Stacked]

so no matter what the last time youve eaten was or how intense/long your cardio is (within reason) you wont affect muscle? just curious as to the science of it if anyones come across it + why it wont affect lean mass

[strtrcer00]

dinoiii just wrote a really good post about it in the training section under a thread entitled "true or false" check it out it should answer a bunch of your questions

[Stacked]

missed that one, thanks, so to quote dinoiii:
"the first thing you should do in the morning to optimize both metabolism and the hormonal environment is grab for a spoon or fork. I don't care if you have to set it on your nightstand to do it.

In any event, the idea hypothesized behind working out on an empty stomach surrounds the same idea; you'll be glycogen-depleted, however completely catabolic - terrible combo overtly."



now why does that make me feel uneasy about cardio after 10 hrs of fast?

[strtrcer00]

hey I'm all for eating, u don't have to tell me twice:D

[dinoiii]

hey I'm all for eating, u don't have to tell me twice:D

Still, just one fork by the nightstand please, not the entire dining set. ;)


D_

[strtrcer00]

damn and I had just finished moving my bed to the kitchen