Best time to work out..

[ShastaB]

Just wondering if someone can help me out with one of the oldest questions, is there a better time to work out? Day or night?

[Superman]

ShastaB, It depends on your goals. The best time to do cardio is in the morning on an empty stomach. If your tring to bulk up, the best time is in the evening. But keep your diet clean and get your protien before bed so your body has the nutrients while you sleep, thats when you build.

[AXResources]

I like my views on dieting and protein feel this is a per case basis. I have my best workouts and night and lose weight easily doing that. I do agree that cardio works best in the morning on an empty stomach, but I think it is also great right before bed.. Hit the cardio for 30mins, jump in the shower and burn fat in your sleep.. It is great.

[skip]

how much cardio do you guys do?

[italionstallionl]

i cardio 2 a week on my off days for about 20 min. when i lift i warm up rowing or on eliptical for about 4-5 min

[dinoiii]

Many times, cardiovascular work (unless doing it for goal-specific purpose - i.e.- track runner, etc...) is HIGHLY UNECESSARY!!!

I will give you a couple quick what I call rapid fire reasons here but I really could go on for hours about why this is true.

(1) If you are training with enough intensity, your heart rate is already up.

(2) Diff. muscle fibers (type I) are stimulated for cardio as opposed to weightlifting (type II) and training the two at the same time IS NOT IDEAL!!!! One will be sacrificed. It often lies with the slow twitch which is not ideal for body composition.

(3) If you feel dire need to get the heart racing, remember that cardio does induce hypertrophy and an enlarged heart is NEVER going to lead to a good thing.

(4) Watching diet and the "PROPER" type of weight training will aid you in acheiving your physique goals much quicker. For instance, as one example of why: for each pound of muscle tissue you pack on, you aid your body to burn UP TO an extra 35 calories per hour - now multiply that by 24, now that number by 365, you get the idea. Most people often take a step forward with a weight training session, then take two back with elimination of your efforts with a cardio session + alternative muscle fiber stimulation which allows feeding body fuel demands through type II fibers.

(5) I really could go on and on...there are a number of workout plans out there - if it is your desire to do it, minimally do interval training x's no more than 2 times per week, and curb it at 20 minutes...probably safer at 15 minutes to stave off Cortisol shaving off muscle tissue. For the reasons listed above, loss of muscle tissue would lead to less calories being burned.

btw: if you choose to do ANY CARDIO on a lifting day - NEVER DO IT BEFORE a workout as you will sacrifice glycogen going into your all important lifts. You could do cardio after your workout and get the same effects as if you did it on an empty stomach before eating on days off from lifting. There are actual studies I could dig up to support this if there are true interests here.



I hope this helps....

[dinoiii]

By the way the original question....I workout in the a.m. for endocrine reasons.

One thing you have to watch out for is Melatonin levels in the morning. I am planning to post an article here about that to hope people can get their hormones straight and help them work for them.

One thing to watch for in the evening is cortisol levels. A common-sensical explaination for this is that throughout the day at work, etc... this stress hormone builds up and you could be walking into the gym in a big heap of trouble. If you workout in the morning (resistance), it is imperative to use some sort of PRE-WORKOUT nutrition. This is not only goal-specific, but as many have suggested, case-specific as in timing, body-types, etc....

[italionstallionl]

dinoii, you think i should quit the short warm ups?

[dinoiii]

I think you should warm up, instead, with a nice light set or two of a cpd movement. (i.e.- squat w/ 40-60% 1RM x rep out just prior to failure)....then switch gears to heavier lifts - IF CHANGING BODY COMPOSITION IS THE GOAL. Of course, if endurance improvment (incl. muscle endurance not pure physical) is the goal, my recommendations would differ slightly.

If you move from one move to another a new "warm up" is unecessary, especially if you are moving between two moves to work the same muscle group.

i.e.
Lift 1 - Squat (x 1-2 warm-up sets)
Lift 2 - Lunges, etc... (w/o warm-up sets)

Too often I see people do a warm up with every set of lifts. This is actually a waste and something that will likely lead to overtraining in its truest sense. The only set that affords less than full intensity is the first 1-2 sets of "true warm-up."

[italionstallionl]

gotcha, what i have been doing is my 4-5 min warm up, then if i do bi's i will do 1 set of 15-20 reps of curls to get the blood flowin to that muscle

[wedgylx]

dinolli i'd have to say you're the first person i've ever heard of having that view. How could you not only say that cardio isn't very important to us as body builders, but also that its unhealthy? That IS what you're saying right?

No matter how intense you're training your heartrate is going to get much higher from an intense cardio session.

of course too much cardio is going to hurt your anabolic activity. Thats why cardio should be kept short and sweet, like HIIT.

if running a few times a week puts you at that much of a risk for an enlarged heart, why arent people dropping like flies in the gym?

obviously when bulking up catabolism isnt a huge worry because you're taking in so many cals a day. But when you're cutting and doing cardio sure catabolism is a worry. But you know that going into the cutting phase, that you are going to lose some muscle.

not only do i think cardio is useful, I think its necessary to this sport

[dinoiii]

I wish I could address this more now....I will later...

The one thing I will offer you is this as well as your liver being susceptible to toxicity is PURELY DUE TO SUSCEPTIBILITY. You protect your liver for piece of mind while on PH's, I DON'T DO CARDIO FOR PIECE OF MIND HERE. If a guy is not susceptible, he will likely not be affected, but you are taking the same chances --> have a sports physical and see if you are at risk for HOCM (aka - HCM).

I ask you to look up a guy by the name of Jim Fixx. He is the one who is virtually dubbed with starting the cardio craze to sell more fitness machines. Ironically, he also died while out jogging.

I said that cardio has its place, yet its place remains GOAL-SPECIFIC. Try interval training with free weights if you are in dire need of raising your heart rate. The two tasks do NOT concurrently mix (training Type I and Type II fibers) provided you are not on any anabolics at which time, you could also make a case that cardio is highly unecessary.

[wedgylx]

I guess we'll just agree to disagree

[dinoiii]

Well I agree there! :D

[max von]

The best time for me to lift is at night after work cause i am usually still pumped up and not tired and ready to go

max von

[wedgylx]

The best time for me to lift is at night after work cause i am usually still pumped up and not tired and ready to go

max von

plus GH levels are at thier peak

[dinoiii]

plus GH levels are at thier peak



This is simply not true! Cortisol and GH are inversely related in secretion patterns first of all. The stress you feel from your job or school is likely to drive cortisol up while slamming GH down.

I just simply don't have time to get into a discussion about how there is a constant release of GHrP and IGF-1 levels...this is a lengthy discussion. This hormone is probably the most interrelated hormone in your body really.

One thing you have not taken into consideration is that while you are post-prandial, you are likely to be secreting a lot of Somatostatin as well which is not site specific. This is also the reason some PRE-workout shakes do NOT make sense either. Unfortunately, you must sieve through the pseudoscience as well. This is really a different topic all-in-all though.

[max von]

dinoiii im sorry i lost you on that on if there is abetter time as far as body goes let me know cause since ive been on here my gains have been great and dinoiii your info has helped alot. But no offense you lost me on this one thanks

max von

[dinoiii]

Jesus,

I am sorry - I just re-read it and while it made sense in my head what I wanted to say, I see it came out as a stream-of-conscious response. See that's what happens when you have way too much science on the brain boys.

I will post an article shortly about this very topic.

And as far as helping if I have at all. I appreciate the complement. Your success is more of a thank you though! I get excited for guys watching the true science and how it can change their bodies.

[max von]

i will look forward to that post always enjoy reading them. I have some pm questions that i would like to ask you some time if you have time and are avalible


max von

[dinoiii]

Seeing how the PM option is not available, you can either reach me via eitehr of the following avenues:


IM: medmus19 (aol) // absivs_revenge (yahoo)

email: absivs_revenge@hotmail.com // dhouser@doctor.com

[max von]

dinoiii
ill send you my question here in a couple day thanks for the infor

max von

[dinoiii]

got ya

[vprvnm]

I know this is an old post but here goes (a lot of people want to know the answer to the original questions)

First off I'm not a doctor nor a scientists, only know what I have read.

Anytime you exercise is a good time regardless!!! I agree with the other guys in that it depends on your goals. Working out in the morning provides that good kick to start your day and your body releases endorphines that in turn make you feel good for the rest of the day (some want to crash midday from being tired though). But research has shown that working out from about 3p to 5p can have the best chance for gains. Your body follows a series of patterns call circadian rhythms that regulate everything from when you sleep to hormone levels to body temp. If you look at these patterns, testoserone, body temp., pheromones, and metabolism (along with other beneficial things to bbs) are at their peak during the time frame above. Many lifters have reported being able to lift quite a bit more during this time of the day (as much as 20 lbs more). Like I said, I'm not a doc nor do I know this is for certain, but I have read a number of scientific sites that all caim the same thing. Here is a link if you want to read a little about it.

http://www.fitfaq.com/best-time-to-exercise.html

Hope this helps.

[max von]

nice post with some good infor good job ive tried lifting in the morning and i just seems that my body just does not want to get into the mode. plus gym is busy where at night ive been there when im the only in a certain part i kinda like that part no muscle heads in there wife beaters

max von

[italionstallionl]

thanks, great post

[vprvnm]

Also you guys can try and google cercadian rythems and do some research on them. By knowing these rythems you can adjust a lot in your lifestyle to get the most out of your body at the ideal times. Another thing I forgot to mention in the post was that the chemicals that control pain sinals are at their lowest around 3p-5p as well so your muscles don't hurt as much as well. Also try not to break anything until this time of day, it won't hurt as bad lol :wink:

[italionstallionl]

haha, thanks for the advice

[dinoiii]

So where's the references in that article?

Anyway - After a long day at work...likely "stressful" --> where is it you anticipate your cortisol levels to be? The article argues thermogenesis > cortisol. What? :?

I can see better "perceived" workouts due to essentially being more "up" etc.... however, this is NOT the science of hormones nor circadian rhythms. Circadian Rhythms are fine (best argument still resides with Melatonin levels being the least from the pineal gland around the 6:00am hour - still an endocrine argument) BUT PULSATILE RELEASE of HORMONES is by far MORE IMPORTANT.

My conclusion is they just like the way it sounds to say the word "circadian."

[dinoiii]

btw: for all you real-worlders...how many people have gotten up and comparatively lifted at early am hours over the course of a few months to check it out?

I am guessing on the answer.

[italionstallionl]

over a course of a few months....no

over a course of a few days.....yes

i dont care how my internal body levels are comparatively in the morning and afternoon, because in the morning my focus is not there, my energy is not there, my determination is not there, and my drive is not there. so no matter how it is there is no way i could see gains lifting in the morning no matter what the levels of different chemicals are in my body are due to the factors previously mentioned.

[dinoiii]

Of course, I agree with everything you state stallion. I think the one thing we all agree upon is that getting to the gym is the most impt. For instance if I can't make it in the am...I certainly would defer to the afternoon before dumping it.




If anyone has access to medical books...there is a good graph on page 370 of a book entitled "Basic and Clinical Endocrinology" from Greenspan and Gardner (Figure 9-7). I think where the confusion lies in the presentation is the pulsatile release pattern shows an increase in ACTH levels between 4-8am....this however via negative feedback levels implies LOW cortisol. Another consideration for the science types - when you eat, cortisol is released, when you starve yourself cortisol is released. Granted if you workout on an empty stomach - this is likely a factpr - but we all know how big a fan I am not of cardio, but you have more fed and fasted state alterations come mid afternoon for increased cortisol fluctuations - then to add to it...the moment you pick up that first weight, cortisol shoots up again.

In contest of the "warmth" theory presented on that site....when IL-1 is produced (an inflammatory cytokine that induces a fever-like state and/or increases body temp and thermoregulatory mechanisms), it induces the release of ACTH secretion leading to INC cortisol. I think then this implies that the am you are "warmest" - cortisol inhibits IL-1 being highest in the pm would say you are coldest in the afternoon.