diet and supliments

[caniplaywith_madness]

what do people here eat throughout the day. not just one meal. how much do you eat. im 5'5 165 pounds. i havnt lifted weights for two years i do all cardio now because it has had much better results in lowering cholesterol. i want to lean down. get cholesterol under control. i noticed a lot of people drink protein drinks why not just drink 1% milk its so much cheaper and less expensive. the suplements i take now are vpx cex creatine. what do you all suggest for diet and suplements? also im not interested in anything that is about to be banned and im also from california. thanks. matt

[dinoiii]

WOW

#1: For your goals, LIFT WEIGHTS...you'll realize the cardio will get you no more closer to what you describe even years down the line. To say lifting weights will not lower cholesterol levels is highly inaccurate, just be sure not to follow the bodybuilding magazine's version of what a workout should entail.

#2: Protein - wherever, you get it...it is not necessary to ingest any supplements from the protein powder category you are right. However, I am willing to bet you cannot ingest all the protein you really need from the sounds of your post and your goals. Let me ask b/c it seems as though a big problem is cost with many people and protein powders: Why does it apparently seem so outrageous to pay say $20-30 for usually 30+ servings (granted you will likely get only get 10-15 "meals" out of them), leaving you at appx. $2-3 per meal (w/o adding in any extras ...i.e. - fis oil, etc...)

#3: 1% milk is just that a milk protein with MILK FAT. Milk fat is the hardest fat for the body to digest. Minimally move to skim. However, protein powder still gives you further control over your macronutrients with excessive lactose intake which WILL not get you where you want to go. Minimal request: look into Carb Countdown brand milk products.

#4: You really have not given much in the way of current BF% et al. So I will ask but only one question about supplements you should be considering. I see you mention CEX, yet fail to mention the following which for someone looking to save cash are more essential:
* Multi-Vitamin
* FISH OIL (especially considering your goals), alt. FLAX OIL
* Potentially additionally water-soluble vitamins (B complex, Vit C) at times when you don't ingest your multi- vitamin

#5: Currently I have clients eat more meals - the better. Some people eat up to as many as 8-12 times/day. It really is a how serious are you question. You failed to really talk about what you are willing to do.

#6: Did I mention, LIFT WEIGHTS?

--> Maybe this gives you a start. I dunno. However, if you start getting things in order by year's end next (2005), you will likely be the one offering the advice to the next guy who is inquiring.

[caniplaywith_madness]

ive tested my bf% only with a regular weight scale i dont know how accurate it is but it is at 24% right now. i am naturally stocky. i have big arms and shoulders for someone my size i have very big calves. all this runs in the family. but i have a LOT of fat too. frigen cholesterol runs in the family big time. i take 6 grams of omega 3-6-9 with flax seed. i take 6 pills of plant sterols which include beta-sitosterol , campesterol,stigmasterol,brassicasterol. i take natures sunshine brand muly vitamins and minerals. natures sunshine calcium-magnesium. i just started on the cex a few months ago that i got from you. i also got the myostim by champion n. what i really want is to get my bf% down more than anything. it used to be all i wanted was to gain weight lift weights. i can still do that. i just bought a stand alone punching back with gloves and foot pads for kicking :D. i love boxing and better mixed martial arts. ummmm i am willing to eat many meals a day. up to 6 or so i guess depending on my schedual. you guys know so much more ill take your advice.

[caniplaywith_madness]

i forgot to say i also have champion nutrition met endurance and muscle nitro that i bought from da.com but sinse i hadnt started lifting weights yet i hadnt taken any of it. i also have a bunch of cham nut. creatine extreme left over from when i used to lift.

[dinoiii]

Personally I do not care for Myostatin products. I think companies that originated the idea got wind that it simply didn't pan out in vivo as planned post-petri dish experiment. As for weight loss, if you are a female...there is one such "study" which does show increased weight loss in females in vivo, but nothing for males.

As for the lifting weights, male or female - start TODAY. This will make a big difference in body composition (ie.- drop BF% in long run, while perhaps increasing body weight due to muscle increases). If you are a male, lift HEAVY (heavier than you thought you could lift and what the average Muscle and Fitness magazine program may tell you, even if it means you can not make the magic number of "10 reps."

The large calves after being reliant on cardio does not surprise me. Do NOT sacrifice leg workouts (i.e.- the squat) in hopes that your legs will spontaneously shrink though. Keep focused with big compound and olympic lifts like the squat, bench press, clean + press, deadlift. Decrease the amount of cardiovascular work you are doing. I am not saying to "stop training your heart" - you will be doing plenty of that with the aforementioned lifts.

I would suggest getting your diet in order first, before reliance on too many pills becomes your reality. There are some great pills to try, but please post what a sample diet regimen for a complete average day. We could tweek from there.

When you get this all together, there are many neat pills, but provided all else is not addressed - I would not advise a pill. This may not be the advice you are looking for, but it is the truth. It may be acceptable at this point to tell you to try a product called Sesathin from Avant Labs. Incorporation of that at this stage is ok to be used as some of your essential oil products. I like Udo's Choice blend of Fatty Acid's but there are plenty great varieties out there.

Lastly, your high cholesterol issue. I am currently only a medical resident and would like you to verify this with your doctor, but interestingly enough, not much of what is said about cholesterol ingestion has panned out in studies. What I am saying is that things like the Atkins, SOuth Beach, Low carb diets, have positive effects on blood lipid levels, NOT LOW FAT diets. You may want to give one a try. If you are a male or female, this is likely due to hormonal control - if you can get your hands on adrenal synthesis models, you can see its (cholesterol's - of the dietary variety that is post packaging in things called chylomicrons) involvement in all adrenal hormones, including testosterone, glucocorticoids and estrogens. To make a long boring story to most short, it aids in clearing of arteries not clogging of them (also, testosterone levels for the same reason LOWER stroke levels and heart attack risk, contrary to what the media preaches - this can all be referenced in the Journal of Endocrinology and Metabolism).

I hope some of your answers are in there.

[caniplaywith_madness]

ok lift very heavy low reps. less cardio.
choose low carb diets instead of low fat diets.
low carb diets usually are low fat diets too right?
also i dont know what adrenal synthesis models.
are they drugs or suppliments?
i had a cholesterol test a few days ago. i just started on
vytorin. heart disease just really runs in the family
both gparents died in 50s from heart attack.
dad had quad open heart surgery at 69. i eat good
and excercize regularly and my chol is 310 even tho my
good cholesterol is good. im 33 year old male btw.
i see my dr. about the blood lab results in a few days.
i had a stress test the other day, the dr. said my heart
looked very good. ill ask her about adrenal synthesis models tho.

thanks very much for the help. i appreciate it.

[caniplaywith_madness]

oh and as far as my diet
i drink a mocha that i make with 1% milk in the morning
lunch i eat out usually something like mexican or chinese
dinner something like pasta or eggs
then usually at night i use my juicer and add something like
1 apple, 20 pieces of green beans, two handfulls of spinich,
1 lemon, 1 handful of parsley, 1 zucchini.
i drink about 2/3 of this and give the rest to anyone who wants
the rest. also at night thats when i get the munchies and sometimes
chocolate

[dinoiii]

Ok,

lets see what I can do with that...just have one question...are you a vegetarian? This makes a difference //// I only ask because of the food choices you make. If so, more things must be considered - while difficult I know some pretty ripped people who claim to be strict vegetarians. The question then is are you a vegan?

How willing are you to incorporate change b/c there are some things I would certainly change?

The adrenal hormone synthesis model is how cholesterol (which is a steroid) is involved in the synthesis of testosterone, and other hormones in your body. I apologizing for not making it clear that this was not something you could take, etc...

What you have to realize is that you are through your ingestion of Carbs increasing the amount of VLDL or very low density lipoprotein in your blood, although not producing outward signs is the first step in the synthesis of LDL, the bad cholesterol. While your cholesterol is high (it usually depends upon the lab) could be directly attributed to the VLDL levels giving kind of a false read. You never gave a reading for your HDL (good cholesterol), so I am not sure what the "high" interpretation is in the labs (usually > 30-35 mg/dl).

When is your doctor's apt.? Exact day. Make certain you don't get a calculated LDL and get a direct, even though you can roughly guess your actual with the estimate offered. When you get your results, I will offer you a list of things (supplement-wise) that show some promise in the literature to aid in cholesterol control if you still want them.

[dinoiii]

Now that I have re-read your post, I see you mention you eat eggs. Obviously not a vegan. So I must ask...lacto-ovo?

If not - where's the beef? Or minimally meat in general?

[caniplaywith_madness]

cool. not i have no problem with meats. i will eat most any meat. i avoid pork and fish without fins such as lobster. although ill eat those too rarely. my appointments tomorrow morning. so ill give you the amount of good chol, triglicerides? chol, and any other numbers she has. i also lifted weights yesterday. did my back. and why am i surprised at how sore i am. thanks again

[caniplaywith_madness]

say my dr. today. can you believe this. one month of vytorin 10/20mg has lowered my total chol from 300 to 180.
here were the results.
total chol 185
ldl chol 103
hdl chol 47
trigly chol 173

ive lifted weights for only two days. i didnt go kamikaze. not too heavy because im just getting back to lifting but i am the most sore i think i have ever been in my life. i knew i should have taken it slower.

[dinoiii]

Those are good results. Just a couple things to consider while on this drug as it still is in the "rough" stages. By that, I mean - its kinda like at the Vioxx level.

There are 2 components to the drug.

The things I can tell you considering you are posting here are:

(1) Do NOT take ANY prohormones!!! Hepatotoxicity is a more common complication of most cholesterol-lowering agents.
(2) Try and make sure the pains you get while you are sore from a new workout are distinguishable from the pains you may receive from a terrible complication, albeit rare of one of the components of the drug: Simvastatin.

I only suggest at this level that you really watch particular lab values if you are unaware of them....try and get a baseline as soon as possible:

ALT, AST, + CK




*** Note: there are still some things that may prove useful to you in the supplement world. I will post them a little later....tough day on the wards though....I will need some sleep right now. Give you a little more tomorrow.

[caniplaywith_madness]

ok gotcha and thanks

[italionstallionl]

madness you ask why do people buy protein. 1-you would have to drink a sh-t load of milk to get the amount of protein from powder. 2- some people dont like milk (myself) 3-your body needs different types of protein at different times

i have a question for you, you are taking cex, but why? just like you ask about the protein and milk, why dont you just eat a bunch of steak to get more creatine?

[max von]

itallion i would have to agree with you that in order to get 200 + grams of protien from milk you would need to drink about 10 gallons and by then you would way about 50lbs heavier. I agree that i cant drink milk as it bloats me way up

max von

[caniplaywith_madness]

im totally ignorant when it comes to suppliments. to me protein is protein. right now im just trying to learn and see what other people like to take. seems like ae2 and Cre2bolics. are some of the top suppliments. whey proteins also. still learning. right now at home i have cex. muscle nitro. met endurance and endurox.

[dinoiii]

You guys ever try Carb Countdown Milk from Hood. The Chocolate is a great addition to even a bodybuilder diet.

[italionstallionl]

ive seen commercials for it, but never tried it. is it real milk? fat free? dont really know anything about it

[dinoiii]

They do have fat free versions or low-fats ... selection has varied from store to store up here in New York.

Carbs are low. I will have a glass or two or mix it in other recipies that call for milk. Its protein content has been upped by 50-60% and this too is dependent on which one you bye as compared to regular milk. Mind you, I can only assume that it is regular milk as I am away from home right now and do not have the luxury of checking the carton.

The only gripe in today's carb-bastardizing society is that it costs a bit more - but I think it is definitely worth it and MUCH better than regular milk.

Hope this helps what you were looking for. When I get home I can actually post the actual Nutrition Facts label if you are interested or the next time you run to the store, give it a grab and check out the label. You can probably find other info on the Hood website about actual ingredients and if you do chose to do this before I can get around to posting, perhaps you could do the honors.

[wedgylx]

I love the carb-countdown milk. It tastes even better than regular milk! Its just so damn expensive. I almost feel guilty using it.

[dinoiii]

I know what you mean about feeling guilty. They'll get away with it though as long as demand is high unfortunately.

[italionstallionl]

madness-i recommend you stay away from muscletech nitrotech not because it is bad or harmful to you, just way overpriced. also, dont ask people in gnc what they recommend, waste of time

[dinoiii]

Certainly good rules-of-thumb Stallion!

Both suggestions hold much truth!

[italionstallionl]

whenever you run out of your nitro tech get back on here and ask for some recommendations i would say syntrax nectar is very popular for fruit flavored, but i didnt like it, im gonna try ergo's gf pro, ast vp2 is good, if you wanna go more economical get just a wpc or blend of concentrate and isolate, dont know whats offered on this site but check it out and post what your interested in, everyone im sure would be more than happy to help you out

[max von]

madness
CREA2bolics and AE2 the stuff man they have jump started my workout way beyond where i thought it could go. I am also do a thread for Rodney as now im doing nozsupercharge and AE2 check it out i try to up date all the time

max von

[dinoiii]

Hey max - want to give some examples of the "jump start" this provided to your workouts.

I will take a look at your other posts.

[max von]

Dinoiii
1 it gets me in the right frame of mine to work out cause i can see instant results .

2 i had hit a plateau with my traing and after 12yrs traing i was starting to get bored and thinking of quiting cause i was just not getting the results.

3 as i started to see the results begin to come back and the size added and bodyfat drop i got excited to to work out again.

4 also my body does not seem to get fatigued and actually like to be pushed harder and harder

5 best part of it all is when your wife tells you your body loos great


thats what i mean about jump starting my work out. now im not saying the supp did all this alot of it was my own mind and desire came back but sometimes a total change up helps out. Thats what i mean about jump start to my work out.


max von

[max von]

dinoiii
i forgot to mention that i had something in my left that really motivated me to get my ass going to

max von

[dinoiii]

Max -

I will be 100% honest with you,

EVEN if a supplement's effects are placebo-type, did it not do what it was essentially setting out to do? In the long run, who cares if it wasn't even responsible for your results per se...it was its use that you felt "jump started" your workouts and got you back in there - so IMO, it is a VERY EFFECTIVE supplement indeed!!!

I am not saying it is in fact placebo, but you make a comment about "I'm not saying the supp did all of this, a lot was my own mind and desire..." You approached the supplement looking for something and got so much more.

I tell you I am happy your wife likes the "new" you - imagine how other woman feel. This should make your wife feel all the better (she now has what the other woman certainly desire)...a woman's striving for her own domain and she can now claim what is hers.